On January 10th 2023 a select group of Internationally acclaimed Academics, Journalists, Authors, Business leaders and Ivy league students gathered in New York City for a historic evening.
Yale University Professor Paul Franks interviewed Rabbi Chaim Yehudah (Yudel) Krinsky, the personal secretary of the late Lubavitcher Rebbe OBM and Secretary General of the Lubavitch movement.
The event was sponsored by the Levitin Family in commemoration of the 12th Yahrzeit of their grandmother Miriam Weiss OBM.
Gutnick Academy is honored to release the entire interview in honor of Gimel Tamuz, the upcoming 32nd Anniversary of the physical passing of the Rebbe.
Interview | Rabbi Yehuda Krinsky & Professor Paul Franks
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Naomi Gutnick: Okay. Good evening. My name is Naomi Gutnick. It's an honor to be here with Rabbi Krinsky and Professor Frank's at Shabtai New York City. I've enjoyed every Shabtai event I have been to. Each one interesting, unique, and an important space like no other. I'm sure tonight we are in for a real treat. I'm not normally a public speaker, but when my dear sister Toby asked me to say a few words about our beloved grandmother, Miriam Weiss, whose 12th yahrzeit is in a few weeks, I agreed as to speak of her is a privilege. I had the lucky fortune to live with my grandparents for five of my formative teenage years. I wish all of you here could have met her. She was special and really extraordinary. Miriam Weiss was only 19 years old when her life was irrevocably changed as the fires of anti-Semitism, hate and brutality came to her and her family's doorstep. Her parents, brothers, grandparents and most of her extended family were murdered by the Nazis. From a young age, Miriam was a clever solutionizer who had this great capacity to think and act quickly and efficiently in the moment. This helped her to survive circumstances that read like a thriller mystery Hollywood film fraught with nail biting, heart stopping twists and turns. Post-war Miriam, alone in the world like many, she surged ahead to create a life for herself together with our dearest grandfather, Reb Berel Weiss.
Naomi Gutnick: She was a survivor, not a victim, and this narrative was evident until her day of passing. Miriam was a woman before her time. Like many great people, she was highly accomplished, industrious, and yet so very humble. A shrewd and capable businesswoman who, together with my grandfather, built a successful business. She was also growing her own vegetables, had chickens hatching fresh eggs in the backyard, and was making weekly sourdough challah long before it was in fashion, not to mention the days when she was making pasta from scratch. I would come home from school to pasta hanging all over the kitchen, drying. I do not believe she had a lazy bone in her body. She personified the concept of Hamaseh hu haiker. The deed is the most important. An early riser, she seized each day and maximized it to the fullest. She never seemed to understand the fuss we made of her, as she shared herself and her lessons freely and with great love and affection. But here's the thing. Babby, as we called her, endured real suffering in her lifetime not only the loss of her parents and family, who were cruelly taken from her long before their time, of whom she confided in me in her 80s that she still woke up in the middle of the night, yearning for. Babby suffered physical suffering as well in the last 20 or so years of her life.
Naomi Gutnick: As someone who lived with her for part of this time, what I saw and learned from her is how she approached her suffering. She did not complain. She did not deny it. She endured the reality of it. But within her suffering, she chose life and she enjoyed living it. She did not turn away from G-d in her suffering. She turned towards God in her suffering. She spoke lovingly of what she would say, the Hailikeh Bashefer the Holy Creator. She attributes- she attributed so much of her success in her life to His blessings, and despite all that she had been through in her life, she gave over this deep love and respect for God and His Torah to the next generation. To have her children and grandchildren and great grandchildren, and now great great grandchildren continue in the ways of our forefathers, was like her very breath, to instill the values of her upbringing into the next generation was crucial to her. It is fitting that today we will hear from the Lubavitcher Rebbe's secretary, Rabbi Krinsky, as the Rebbe was the leader of world Jewry to a generation crushed by the Holocaust, when many Jews felt more comfortable to keep their religion under the radar, the Rebbe encouraged a traumatized, sorry, generation to practice their faith with pride and in public. The Rebbe had an enormous impact on my grandparents and the trajectory of our whole family.
Naomi Gutnick: The Rebbe was my grandmother's link to her past, as well as the link to her future. Babby struggled with survivor's guilt, and it was only in her later years that she mentioned to me that she had recently read a concept from chasidus, the deeper dimension of the Torah, that each soul comes into this world to complete its own unique mission. She turned to me and she said with great feeling and relief, it must have been that I just had to fulfill my mission, and that is why I survived. Well, Babby, if even a part of your mission was to inspire the next generation to be strong and have faith-Emunah, and trust-Bitachon, in God to learn and follow in His ways, I say that you succeeded many times over. For your children, grandchildren, great grandchildren, and great great grandchildren, you are a compass and a guiding light as we follow in your footsteps and endeavor to instill the same values in our and our family's lives. Though you have been gone for some time, you are a daily part of our lives as we think, what would Babby say? What would Babby do? Babby, you live on. May your holy Nishama have an aliya, Miriam bas Alter Mordechai. Thank you all for being here. Oh, sorry. I'm introducing our host for this evening.
Aaron Dessauer: Thank you, Naomi. Thank you. Wow. So many people. It's like the bar mitzvah speech that I never gave. So it's my pleasure to welcome you to my and my partner Emily's home. Thanks for coming on this cold and gray evening. Thank you. Naomi and the Levitin family from Seattle for sponsoring this event in honor of their grandmother's yartzeit. My name is Aaron Voloj Dessauer. I'm a alum of Yale Law School, where I studied with Avi, Greg Dubinsky, Sam, and other people who I don't see right now, where I studied law and philosophy, and also later taught law and philosophy. It's an honor and privilege to welcome Rabbi Krinsky, the personal secretary to the late Lubavitch Rebbe and chairman of Chabad International, and Paul Franks,the Robert and Patricia Weiss Professor of Philosophy and Judaic Studies at Yale. Tonight's guests require no introduction, because everything that could be said about them could not be enough. For me personally, this talk is very special. As I mentioned to the rabbi earlier, I first encountered Chabad in Boston on Harvard's campus when I first came to this country from Germany. It was the first time that I was welcomed anywhere as a Jew, regardless of how religious or observant I was. Whenever at dinner at the Chabad house at Harvard, Rabbi Zarchi and his family would welcome me as their own, like like their own family member, which as an immigrant and as a Jew, meant so much to me.
Aaron Dessauer: I grew up, as you can probably tell from my accent, in Germany. I was one of the few Jews growing up there in a in a small college town called Münster. Münster is mostly known for its Catholic divinity school. In fact, the late Pope Joseph Ratzinger was a professor of the Divinity School. Needless to say, there were not many Jews in my hometown and the only people who actually read and studied Hebrew, let alone Aramaic, were the faculty members of the Catholic Divinity School. Most of the members of the synagogue in Münster were families who had to return to Germany after the Holocaust, and always felt a sense of regrets about having returned to the country of the perpetrators. There's also like a sense of survivor's guilt, as Naomi mentioned, and it's something that I know very much about. And I feel like if I had met your grandmother, I could very much relate to her and her what seems to be a very, very inspiring, adventurous life story. To Jews like me growing up in Germany, being Jewish meant to be different. And frankly, something it meant to be something you would be ashamed about, not something you would ever celebrate. When I grew up, I don't recall that I've ever been to someone's house for Shabbos.
Aaron Dessauer: I never celebrated any Jewish holidays with strangers. And I also never had a formal Jewish education. So when I grew up, I didn't understand the richness of what it means to be Jewish. That all changed when I was later in New Haven, and when I met Toby and Shmully and came to the dinners of Shabtai, which at the time was called the Chai Society. It was at Shabtai where I found my intellectual and spiritual home. And when I first heard one of the co-founders of Shabtai, Senator Cory Booker, talk about his favorite midrash, I was thinking, wow, life is Jewish. Life is very different in America than it is in Germany. But joking aside, Shmully and Toby have welcomed me and thousands of others with open arms and included me to their home, fed us with delicious meals, and introduced me to lifelong friends. And most important, perhaps, they expanded my intellectual and spiritual horizons. So thank you so much. I want to extend my gratitude to you, Shmully and Toby for your amazing work. And I'm very grateful that I can pass forward what you have given me when I was in New Haven. So without further ado, please help me welcome Rabbi Krinsky and Professor Franks.
Professor Franks: Good evening everybody. Tonight we will not only learn history, but we'll also make history. Since this is a unique and unprecedented opportunity to hear from Rabbi Krinsky, who was not only a front seat observer, but also a participant in one of the most remarkable developments of Jewish history. But also, I think, of world history, certainly in the last hundred years, the incredible growth and development of Chabad, to the point where it is now the largest Jewish organization in the world. And Rabbi Krinsky had the opportunity to observe the Rebbe up close. And we're looking forward to hearing many stories that have not been told,and hearing many insights and reflections that have not yet been shared. So, Rabbi Krinsky, I'd like to start with your early life. When did your family come to America and where did they settle?
Rabbi Krinsky: Good evening everybody. Pleased to answer the question. Is the mic on, right? My dad was born in 1887. And my mother thereabouts on the Rosh Hashanah, either a year before or a year after. I'm not sure of the exact year. And they came to America at the turn of the century. My father came in 1914- 1913, about the same year as my mother. My father came. He was orphaned at ten and came alone. He was single at the time. And my mother came with her parents and siblings at about that time, as I said. And my mother's family lived in Smilan, not too far from Lubavitch in Ukraine. And they were fortunate to ask the rabbi at the time if they should go to America. He answered in the affirmative. But they should live on a farm. My father was born in Bialystok, which was neither Poland or Russia changed its baalei batishkeit, depending on the different governments. And they met and married in 1914 and it was on the farm near Worcester and in 1915, the first child was born, a boy, and they eventually had nine children. I being the youngest of nine, four brothers and four sisters. And my father's diary, when it came to my birth, he referred to me as a Ben zkunim, born at an older age. They were both mid 40s. And I came along and that's a- it's a very endearing title.
Rabbi Krinsky: We just read about it in the Sedera of the week in Shul, and they vowed at their wedding, before the wedding, that if God will bless them with children, they will do their utmost, and even more than that, to make sure that the children become Torah observers. Shomrei Torah Umitzvah. And they were very successful. I can tell you that my two oldest brothers, Velvel and Moshe, they were cantors. I remember Pearl Harbor on December 7th, 1941, vividly. And in 1942 they both drafted the United States Army. The older brother, Velvel, we called him in Yiddish, was the United States Air Force. He served as a navigator on the bombers if you're familiar with the equipment of B-19, etc. I am. And he was later transferred to become a director of the traffic, air traffic in the battles of the bulge. And my brother Moshe ended up in, in Okinawa in the Pacific scene. Before they left for overseas, they had the opportunity to visit the previous rabbi. Rabbi that we know and talk about today, our father in law. They both had blessings that they should be successful in what they do and come back home untouched. And they both did, thank God. But my younger, the younger of the two was married at the time with a little baby girl, and when he was called, all he could do was bring his wife and baby to our home in Bicknell Street in Dorchester until after the war came home.
Rabbi Krinsky: I want to give some veracity to this title, for this evening is from the Latin School to what was What to Lubavitch. It's an interesting question, and I left Boston Public Latin School before the holidays, the Jewish holidays in 1945. I was 12 at the time. I was in high school at 12 for some reason and after going there for a while, my parents decided, in their wisdom, that they wanted me to be something more than that. And they sent me to Lubavitch. Our family was connected to Lubavitch. My father, he'd be- way before I was born. Our home at that time, for my father and mother was open for all Lubavitcher rabbis who came on missions from the Rebbe himself, at that time, a place where they could stay and they could do what they had to do to fulfill the mission of that particular visit. And so we had we had at Shabbos at the table, we would speak about the Rebbe, and we also spoke about the Rebbe to be. The Rebbe that I'm here to talk about tonight. He was always very, very highly regarded as a genius in Torah and a Baal Midos Tovos. He was a very special human being. And so what happened was, when I came to New York in 1945, I was supposed to come after the when the school year started after Shmini Atzeres and Simchas Torah but my parents, in their wisdom, thought that an older brother was coming to New York for the holidays, for Shmini Atzeres and Simchas Torah
Rabbi Krinsky: and so what better time is there to be by the Rebbe? And I was I was 12, but they thought I would appreciate it. I sure did. So we came two days before Hoshana Raba, the day before Hoshana Rabbah and the night of Hoshana Rabbah, the custom in Chabad is that after 1:00 at night, you recite the whole Tehillim before you go to sleep. So I went from the dormitory where my brother put me up for the for that till after the holiday. And I as soon as they opened the door to 770, I could see the Rebbe standing. From the Beth midrash at the right. At the door. He his beard was black and he was dressed in his Shabbat clothing. Long jacket, if you will. And I was struck by his beauty, by his, by his countenance, saying the Tehillim, I was really drawn. There was something special about his- just just his face. And the next night was already the first night of Shmini Atzeres. I was sitting in the Shul at 770 Eastern Parkway. I had the Shul at that time was half of this size, maybe less than half. And I was there was 6 to 7 youngsters older than me. Teenagers. I was not a teenager teenager yet, and they were just sitting around and talking, and I was talking but sitting around and talking. Around 10:30 at night, I was sitting in the Beth midrash
Rabbi Krinsky: The door was open and the Rebbe was coming out of his office, which is opposite the door to the Beth midrash in his coat, going home. He had previously for the seudah, for the Yom Tov meal, he was up in the second floor with his father-in-law and mother-in-law with the family. And then, when he finished, he was going- told me he lived at that time in the fourth floor of an apartment house on the corner of president and New York Avenue. And in any case, what happened was he saw us kids, and he walked into the Shul and he says, did you have a Hakafo for tonight to go around the Bimah with the Sefer Torah and have a Posuk Ata Horeisa? But we had nothing. Nobody cared about us. He went back to his room and took off his coat, then came into the Beth midrash to about six seven kids that he never saw before. And made sure that they had a Posuk Ata Horaisa and a Hakafa. Well, while they were dancing. You know the circle. You have a hand in, the one in front of you if you've seen the Rikud. And at one point, I wouldn't put my hand on the Rebbe. I was too respectful of them at that time. And but I wanted him to put his hand on my shoulder as the circle turned. And I managed to do that. It made me feel very good. And I remember till this day, as we sit here, I'll never forget it, how he cared for us.
Rabbi Krinsky: He wasn't Rebbe yet. He was just the son-in-law of the previous Rebbe. But as I said, and I grew up in a home where he was also regarded as a very special human being. So that's how it all started. And the day after the holiday, I went into the yeshiva office. And I registered myself with my father's permission. So. Of course. And I started classes. They found a suitable class for me, and I was a student for the next 11 years until I, you know, graduate. But I had Smicha by ordination. And, you know, you never graduate. You're always what you are in terms of Yiddishkeit. What happened then? While I was finishing my English studies, the high school studies in the yeshiva, it was the full high school there with a science lab, etc.. When I finished the, the high school in one building was about a mile away from the headquarters. I then moved over to the headquarters and the advanced classes started and it was a different life. All- I only had the Jewish studies in my mind and it went from year to year. There came a time when I was about 16, 16.5, and I was sitting in the Betz mirash in 770 with my partner the other side of the table. How the boys learn in a Yeshiva, and somebody comes running in from the secretary's office and says, Yudel, that's my Chaim Yehuda, the short is Yudel, do you have a driver's license?
Rabbi Krinsky: I said, as a matter of fact, I do. What do you care? He says the Rebbe wants to go to the Ohel, and there's nobody around who has a car and who can drive. So please, for the Rebbe's sake, with the rent car rental two blocks over, get a car and take him to the Ohel. Well, what greater shock could a 16 year old boy have for that kind of a task? And I was thinking to myself, why did why did I have a license at 16? Because when I was, when I was in Boston, I was actually 18 when I was in Boston, summer vacation with my parents and family and my brothers had a new vehicle bought for their business. And they said, you'll you're here. I'm going to be here for three weeks. Learn how to drive. Why waste your time? I never thought I'd ever have a car at that time. But my dad, my dad was a Schochet with a long white beard says Yudel listen to your brothers. So I learned how to drive. Within a week, I had a license in my pocket and I forgot about it. But the secretary came, come, came running into me. I had no alternative. So I went, I went, and I came back, I survived. I can't tell you how it felt. I don't have that command of the English language to describe it truthfully.
Rabbi Krinsky: What happened was, though, even at the. When the Rebbe went to the Ohel he went at least twice a month. The Ohel is where the previous Rebbe's father-in-law is interred. And so invariably I drove him back and forth. There was not too much talk between us. I sat on the front and he sat on the back, and that went on for a while, for a few years. But something else happened during those years that I was free to just for my Talmudic and Hasidic studies. And there were about the- for some reason there were about 15 or 16 senior students, I was the youngest of them, who were learning a whole day in the, in the, in the yeshiva, in the Beth midrash. And there came a time when the Rebbe would call individuals of the boys in, even though when the Rebbe saw people was at night, during the afternoon or late morning, he would call in singly the boys, asking them what they're studying and the Talmud and the Hasidic studies, and suggest if they would accept it. He would suggest that in addition to the Zmanei Halimud the schedule of the studies, if he suggests that they learn something in Talmud and Hasidic studies. Nobody would ever say no. I didn't say no. He called me too. Actually, at that time I was studying in another building, but he and I was was the youngest of this group of boys and of course, of those, those teenage years. The Rebbe took us under his wing like like children.
Rabbi Krinsky: And I can't I can't be too descriptive. Because what I could do this at this sitting you'd be sitting here till tomorrow morning. But it was a pleasure to be a student of his was a special to attend his his addresses every Sabbath. The Sabbath before the new month, the Jew Hebrew month, the Jewish Hebrew Jewish month. He would speak publicly in the shul with 25 people. And it- I was fascinated. I was always fascinated by him. I was sometimes able to sit in the Davening and Shabbos in the same benches at one end, and I and the other end. I didn't think it was disrespectful, but in any case, that's what I did. And another thing happened. During those years I would receive mail from home, from my father or mother and my brothers and sisters. They were all my- three of my sisters married Lubavitcher young men and were out on Shlichus, one of them in New Haven. Rabbi Hecht, I don't know if your uncle is my brother-in-law, married my older sister Ruthie, and the other two? One was in Chicago and one ended up in in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. So they would send me mail and I used to eat in another building. It's that's not important. But what happened was that the rebbe where, the where the kitchen was, was a mile away, and the boys from 770 went there to eat dinner.
Rabbi Krinsky: And almost a few times a week he would tell one of the boys, when you see Rabbi Krinsky, tell him I have something for him. Well, when I went to ask the Rebbe, he wasn't the Rebbe yet, he was, but he had mail that came from different parts of my family. You know what a postcard is? You can. Everybody can read it. He didn't want that to happen. So instead of putting it out in the hall for the mail for the boys to pick up, he put it on his own desk and saved it until I came. I realized long after that that he knew who I was. He knew my parents. He knew my whole family, and he never opened up to me in that regard. But I appreciated it even more that he did it to me because he adored my parents, the Rebbe, even before he was Rebbe. After the war, World War II, we have a printing house. One of the men who came with me had involved with the printing house. We printed books in Pocking and other European countries, and after they were printed, they had to be shipped to America for use. So invariably they sent it to Boston, Boston Harbor. And so the Rebbe would call my dad and tell him the information was about and send the papers to take it from the from the wharf. And so there was a close relationship.
Rabbi Krinsky: And I know, I know that, that he appreciated what they did for the previous Rebbe in the 20s and 30s, way before I came along, for the people that his father-in-law was sending to America for, for whatever, whatever purpose he had to send them. So there came a time as I grew up, I became closer to the Rebbe. I saw that I could talk to him. And when it came, when I was 20, 22, approximately, some people had called my parents about my availability for the daughters. So. So I discussed it with the Rebbe, and he said I should wait. And about a year later, he invited me to come into his office, and he said that now, if God will provide. And he was involved with my progress in the marriage, it was somebody he picked from a list of five that I didn't know who they were. I told the Rebbe, I know the parents, but I don't know any of the girls. He said, Moshe's Shvester, Moshe's shvester was a chaver of mine in the Betz midrash for years. I never knew he had a sister, but in any case, it worked out and that every summer from 19, in 1949 or so, the Yeshiva would send out Talmidim the boys in pairs, to different parts of the country and sometimes overseas to visit Jewish communities at random. The three week period between Yud Beiz Tamuz and Chof Beis Menachem Av.
Rabbi Krinsky: And I went most of those excursions, and they were very, very, very informative to see how people live in a place where you you don't even know where you're going to stay. But we had we managed, all the boys managed. And in 1957, 1957, I came back with my partner and I wrote a report to Rabbi Hodakov, who was the Rebbe's main secretary at the time, an elderly man, about the travels for those three weeks. We were we were in the West Indies. We were in Jamaica and Dominican Republic and some cities in Florida. I sent a report to Rabbi Hodakov because he was the main person in that particular organization, Merkos L'inyonei Chinuch. And about two days later, he calls me in to his office and he says to me, I thought he was going to ask me something about the report, which he did. I skipped something very important when the Rebbe okayed me to be interested in marrying after he picked one out for me. And I was very glad. She was a wonderful lady. We- I met her, and we both admired each other. And within a few weeks, we decided that we will marry with the Rebbe's consent and blessing. And we decided. It's a long time ago. Rabbi Hodakov asked me what are you planning to do after you're married?
Rabbi Krinsky: I said, I have no - it might sound funny to all of you - I have no plans. I was hoping I could stay on for a year or two. Continue the studies is very dear to me. I really wanted to. And he said you have no plans of for a job or occupation? I said no. I didn't realize why he asked me that question. I found out later. On the day of my wedding was Chof Elul a Monday night. And my parents came in from Boston. We had no family in the area. They had to come by Greyhound bus on the day of the wedding, but such is life. And they davened with the Rebbe's Minyan Mincha, the afternoon prayer at 3:15 in the afternoon with the students in the Betz Midrash that I first saw him in, and the Rebbe noticed that my father was at the minyan, and my mother was in the hallway in the lobby of the near his office and going back into his office after he noticed both my parents were there. And he asked Rabbi Hodakov to ask them to come into his office, the Rebbe's office, which was also not usual. They spent about 15 or 20 minutes with the Rebbe. And when they came out, they said he wanted to talk to them because he doesn't want Yudel to go looking for a job. Yudel was, I can't say slang because the Rebbe said it, but you know, Yudel in Jewish. He doesn't want him to go looking for a job because I want to be the one responsible for his livelihood.
Rabbi Krinsky: It was a shock and I realized now Why Rabbi Hodakov was spying for the Rebbe to ask me if I have a job at hand. And that night the Rebbe officiated at our wedding in the backyard of 770. It was a very rainy afternoon, and it was Monday night, the Chupa was supposed to be, I think, at 6:00. And the rains were very heavy to the extent that the streets and Easter Parkway were overflowing. And at that time the backyard was open. That was made part of the shul, but it was open. And if the sewers for some reason didn't work properly, sometimes the backyard got that way. What are we going to do, the Rebbe was coming out to officiate. It's pouring, women were there gowns and dresses, fancy dresses. And the men were. Are we ready for a wedding? So what happened was it let up after a while, almost completely. And the Rebbe sent word to tell the wedding people that, that he doesn't want. We don't have to worry about him getting wet subsiding. He's ready to come out at any time just to let him know when you want him to come out. He'll come out. Well, it really subsided considerably, but it was drizzling, light drizzle, which is a miracle. A miracle in of itself because it was pouring rain for four hours. And then it came out with his Sidur to say the blessings for the wedding.
Rabbi Krinsky: And he stood under the Chuppah and the rain. The canopy was soaked. It didn't change the canopy, so the water was dripping in the middle of the of the Chupah, of the part of a sitter, and from his onto his brim of his hat and onto the Sidur. And he didn't budge. It was tough, tough to watch, but the Rebbe was not concerned. He knew there was a crowd, came to a wedding and it could not. Rain could have got stronger. So anyway, he finished the Chupah and we live happily ever after. But the view of the fact that the Rebbe said that he's going to take care of me. There were some things that had to discuss with the Rebbe and with my parents. And what happened was that the- we have to work out schedule and salary and things of that nature, and Rabbi Hodakov was very difficult to deal with. The Rebbe said don't press him to much. In any case, that housekeeping were finished and since it was before I said it was ten days before Rosh Hashanah, it didn't fit that I should start working before the holidays. And that's a month of it. It doesn't work when we good for anybody. So the day after Simchas Torah the holidays were over and I got to keep the office, and a few days later I was alone in the office at night, a quarter to eight, and the intercom rang. I knew it was coming from was coming from the Rebbe.
Rabbi Krinsky: There was nobody else there to take the call. So I picked up the phone and the Rebbe asked me to come into his office. I went in, he was sitting in a chair on the side of a desk, a desk, and I could see what he was doing. He would the Rebbe would dictate letters to different secretaries, and he was correcting an English letter, full page that was in the middle of copying or working on when I came into the office. So he asked me to wait a couple of minutes. I was just watching him work, and he was writing things between them, between the lines and in the margins and crossing out things with arrows all over the place, going this and that, and ultimately finished. He stood up and he gave it to me. I knew the hand- Rebbe's handwriting in English, in Hebrew perfectly. I didn't need any advice, but handing it to me, he told me something. He said, don't be surprised. Start from. He asked me if I could retype it, which I said, of course I could. He said, start from the beginning. Read word by word and line by line. And you will see that at the end, it'll all work out. While he was saying that to me, I realized he wasn't only talking about the letter, but this is the future in his office. Take it easy. Don't get lost. The whole workout. Yeah, I think that's good advice for everybody.
Professor Franks: So were you then given general administrative duties? I know that at some point you became particularly involved in public relations.
Rabbi Krinsky: Yeah, that that's what I did till now. Yes. Although there are many people, it's changed. The face of television is not today what it was then? I can talk about that later, if you wish. But in any case, you got some instructions there from the boss, right? Yes.
Professor Franks: Well, I know that you also have the opportunity to get to know the Rebbetzin. And-.
Rabbi Krinsky: Yes.
Professor Franks: Most of us did not have that opportunity.
Rabbi Krinsky: Most people did not know her.
Professor Franks: Yes.
Rabbi Krinsky: Many didn't have ever seen her. Have seen her. I was lucky that I was very, very friendly with her. We had many discussions. We went places together that she couldn't go alone. She was. She was a very special lady. I can understand why the Rebbe married her and she married him. You know, a couple has to have something, a certain, some level that you can get along. They both had that that, that capability. And I would say they were in love with each other. I Rebbe speaks about love in the Sichos Hebrew and English and they I the only ones who could understand each other. I can tell you something about her. It's very dramatic. A lot of things. But there's one thing that that really I saw. If you had to- Should I tell the story, you wanted to ask a question before. You wanted the story. Okay. In Shmini Atzeres Taf Shin lamed Ches That's 1977-. Right. Right, right. The Rebbe in the middle of the Hakafos on Shmini Atzeres standing up at the Aron Kodesh and the Shul with all the chairs, all the seats and the tables were taken out so people could at least stand. There must have been about 5,000 people there in the show, full to the wall to wall. And in the middle of the fifth Hakafa I was up closer to the Rebbe. He turned ashen and he took hold of the chair.
Rabbi Krinsky: And he never did that before for support. And he said no. Something awful was happening. There were some doctors there for the holiday, but they were. They weren't there from different cities. They couldn't. There was nothing they could handle. And but they never wanted to finish the Hakafos. It was the fifth. He had two more to go. So what happened was he didn't speak to anybody. He was in great pain. He didn't look- he was he was not a normal color. But he got up. And with that pain, he went for the other two Hakafos for the sixth and seventh. Then he walked up the stairs. There's an elevator there, but he didn't want to use it. So he went up the stairs to his office. One flight up and he sat in a chair in his office and some doctors who were there for the youngster came in. I know that on that day Hoshana Raba particularly, that I was very disturbed by something that was happening in the family. I knew because I was in the living room. Then I took him home. But the Rebbe and Hoshana Rabbah, just like before Yom Kippur, would give out Lekach honey cake. The people. Pieces of honey cake, I assume. Have you heard that? People would come in. Stand around the block and got a piece of honey cake with the blessing for the year. And the. The Rebbe said that he would he would make Kiddush.
Rabbi Krinsky: But we sit in the Sukkah on Shmini Atzeres not only not only Sukkos, Chabad, sits in the Sukkah on Shmini Atzeres, he would have to go in the Sukkah which was in the front lawn. Smaller Sukkah. So as he was going out to the front lawn, the rebbetzin came walking from the house and President Street with somebody and came into the office the Rebbe's office, and she said, what's going on? And the Rebbe was going to make Kiddush? And she just came. She came just before kiddush, and they brought down the bed from the third floor so that I could lie down and take it easy and rest. In the meantime, the- we called four doctors from New York City, Brooklyn and Long Island. All cardiologists. And they said, each one said, and they came separately, that the Rebbe had a serious heart, a heart attack, and the only thing he can do is go to the hospital. He can't be treated here. It's so serious. And each one said the same thing and the Rebbe said he's not going to a hospital. He has to be treated. He's going to be treated, treated right here in the office. Well, there was no reason in the meantime, one of the doctors who worked in the Jewish hospital, which was not too far from Crown Heights. And he brought a cardiogram. And he hooked up the Rebbe's chest and the wires outside in the table in the four room.
Rabbi Krinsky: And it didn't look good. I could, I could see it wasn't good. And what do you do? It's getting- it's not getting better. It's not going to get better and the Rebbe refuses to go to the hospital. And what do you do? At around 6:30 in the morning, it got even more serious than it was before. And the Rebbetzin, who was upstairs by her sister's apartment by her mother's house, second or third floor, comes walking down the steps to come right into the Rebbe's hallway. The room before the Rebbe's office. And she says, I was standing there with some other people, and she says, what's happening? So the doctor said, we're going to sedate him and take him to the hospital. What are you going to do? He has to go to the hospital. Everybody said has to go to hospital four doctors said he has to go. She said, what is my in English? What is my husband say? He doesn't want to go. So what do you think? A woman in her 70s who has nothing. Who has no relatives around? No children? Same thing for the Rebbitzen. For the Rebbe himself. Two lonely people imagined the Rebbe and Rebbetzin lonely people in the critical situation. And nobody can do anything. We're helpless, and that's critical. It's the Rebbe's life. And she said, in all, the years that I know my husband. Never once for an instant was he not in total control of himself.
Rabbi Krinsky: She said it like I'm saying it casually. Now, I think anybody, anybody from the family would start yelling, do something! She stands there and she says these words in this tone, and I walked from that room to the other side of the hallway where the office my office was, and everybody remained standing there without any thought to be done. And I hear her walking after me to the office. And she turned to me. She, we were both standing, facing each other. And she said to me in English, no no Yiddish. Rabbi Krinsky Ear Kent Doch Azoi Fil Mentshin, Ear Kent Nit Gefinen A Docter Far Main Man. Rabbi Krinsky, you know so many people. Can you find a doctor for my husband? As soon as she said that, like a lightning bolt hit me and I reminded myself, the doctors from New York, four other doctors, by the way, came after the first four went away. Eight doctors saying the same thing. We only get four of the same. They can't take the responsibility because it's beyond their ability to save it. I remember I was in the Rebbe's room a few months before I saw on this table a book of cardiology from a Doctor Weiss from Chicago who happens to have been a student of my brother, Rabbi Shusterman from Chicago. If you ever heard of him. The Rebbe sent him to Chicago he had a Shul he was a Rov and he was a student of his, and he went to Harvard. He was a Harvard grad.
Rabbi Krinsky: Sorry. And yeah, it could not have been better. You'll see. And what happened was I, I called I called my brother-in-law on Yom Tov for Ira Weiss's phone number. He didn't pick up. But Havaye Imo Halacha K'moso, God helped. I kept bringing it. I stopped and ring and ring and ring. He picked up the phone. He realized that it's an emergency. I told him exactly what happened, so he gave me Ira Weiss's phone number. I called Ira Weiss and he tells me, one thing I want to tell you. If the Rebbe doesn't want to go to the hospital, no one should dare take him there. It'll make him worse. How the Rebbetzin knew that? I don't know. That's exactly what- I was standing there. I heard it and he said, I'll take the first plane out. But there's a doctor at Mount Sinai that he was his friend, the same class, and the doctor. Doctor? Doctor, what was the name? Doctor? He was the head of cardiology in the Harvard. In the hospital. I'll think of it as being the doctor. So in the meantime. So that the doctor came from Mount Sinai. He lived in new Jersey. He was there by 9:30, 10:00. He immediately sized up the situation, and he ordered the pharmaceuticals that he needed, and he did what he had to do. And within an hour, the Rebbe was under control. And Ira came. We sent the police escort to American Airlines to LaGuardia to pick him up.
Rabbi Krinsky: He was there around 12:30 from Chicago, and he didn't leave the Rebbe's bedside for two and a half weeks. And I called in the other, the Mazel the luck that I called him, I called another doc. He would have come and gone home. Come back tomorrow afternoon. He didn't leave the Rebbe's bed for two and a half weeks. He lost his practice that he had with other doctors in Chicago who later, when they found out what he went for, couldn't apologize enough. And the Rebbe, he spent a few weeks in the, a little over a month in his office, and the bed was prepared for him. He dined there. We had Minyonim there. Kriyas Hatorah. He didn't miss anything. And while in the room, like a Saturday night, he said he wanted to speak to the world. He's in bed with a hooked up. But nobody could see him. Sorry. Okay, I'll just finish it. And he got it. The doctor said he can- he can speak for 20 minutes. He spoke for 25 minutes. He said he spoke to everybody and the feelings of the world. I know when Rabbi Soloveitchik, who you all know, probably I can talk a lot about him because we were very close families. Talk a lot about it. The when he heard that the Rebbe was ill, he said he can't imagine a world without the Rebbe.
Professor Franks: Okay. I'd like to ask you some questions as well about working so closely with the Rebbe. First of all, with the incredible energy that he had, what was the order of his day, and how was it possible to keep up with him? Did he have the same expectations of other people that he had of himself?
Rabbi Krinsky: Well, he didn't sleep much. He lived- he lived in a in a president suite, in a private home. And day and night, even at night, Bochurim-students would stand by the house to see which lights are going on and off in the house. They were on the first floor. They didn't know if it was the Rebbe or the Rebbetzin, but somebody was somebody was up. He would go home every night, usually every night with a with a shopping bag full of letters that he received in the course of that day or a few days to catch up on the correspondence and would come back in the morning and most of the stuff was answered or handled. Let me- give me a piece of paper. I want to show you how the Rebbe would read a letter. Not only did he knew many languages, but he knew how to read a letter. I would stand in the office and watch him. He would pick up a mail. It's a whole page and he would read it this way. I don't think it took more than a minute and a half, but he wrote an answer to it having to go back to the front if if he had to underline or put an arrow for something that they should do or not do whatever, he had to go back. He had to remember at the beginning of the letter, he did this for thousands of letters. It- I don't know.
Professor Franks: I'm also curious to ask about his leadership style. Was he someone who laid out the vision and he left the details of implementation to other people? Did he ask for different views about what to do before making a decision, or did he present the decision to you?
Rabbi Krinsky: From. Is it on? Let me start from something very recent. We just recently celebrated the holiday of Hanukkah. I'm probably the oldest in the room. I remember Hanukkah when a few people in Bicknell Street put on a menorah. I think this past Hanukkah, more Hanukkah menorahs were lit on this planet in more countries, in more capitals, in more government places, in more private places and shopping like shopping markets and highways and byways that in the history of the Jewish people. Why? Because of the Rebbe. And I remember when it started, it was amazing. It was amazing when it started. And the Shluchim, God bless them. If you have time to talk about the Shluchim and the ladies Shluchos, that is going to save the Jewish people to bring Mashiach, I believe that the- There was one. I remember there were some people here with me who remember he told me way, way back that I should call all the Shluchim that were around - at that time, there weren't so many - and tell them to make, to light Menorahs. Aside from in the home, with the family, in public places, wherever they can. And make parties, Hanukkah Latkes, make something for children, etc.. It started taking off. Then one year he said that the- tell the Shluchim that they should take photographs of these public public menorahs. The next year, again, the first book was called Let There Be Light. The second book was And There Was Light. And it just grew. It just grew. And then there were problems many places didn't want to put on it. They were either embarrassed or they didn't think its public. Pirsumei Nisa, it's for public. In any case, they didn't want to buy into this. So. What happened was he called Nat Lewin again from Harvard.
Rabbi Krinsky: You know who I think you know of him? Nat Nathan Lewin. A good attorney. And he felt that this should be permissible under the First Amendment. And he started making cases. Small towns, big cities, municipals and federal cases and state houses all over the country. And meanwhile, in other countries, the president of the. They were putting up Menorahs an office in the central centers of government. And he won every case and he also prepared, God bless him, packets of information, legal information, so that if a mayor in a Shtetl that doesn't want to allow a Menorah because of church and state separation, he's lost. And they have to they have to agree. They have to agree. It's compulsory. So it went on for a couple of years, struggling until it came to the Supreme Court in Washington. And that took about a year. It happened to be with a public Menorah in Pittsburgh. The mayor didn't want it. Allegheny County Vs. Chabad Allegheny County. Okay. So what happened was it took about a year and we won. When did we win? Very fascinating. Listen to this. Supreme court usually gives out the opinions in July. July 3rd, 1950, 1989. It came out that the court. You have to allow it. That's free speech. And July 4th, you know, July 4th is in America. The front pages of the New York Times, with photographs and every paper across the country, I'm sure, had a story about Hanukkah I even had my picture over there with Nat Lewin. Can you imagine how how. Anyway, so Hanukkah now, it became a staple. It's like.
Professor Franks: This raises an interesting question. Since Chabad made its home here in the United States, which I think was in 1940.
Rabbi Krinsky: What, 1940 became a citizen in 1949.
Professor Franks: So clearly, as you say, Chabad has made a big impact on America. To what extent has Chabad itself become an Americanized organization?
Rabbi Krinsky: It's very Americanized. I want you to know, the previous Rebbeand the Rebbe loved the United States of America. They spoke about it in their public addresses. Look what it did for the Rebbe and the Rebbe. Both Rebbe- both both suffered losses, terrible losses. The- What do you want? What do you want? It became. I when the previous Rebbe came to America in 1940, I was just a few, 6 or 7 years old, I think my parents came to New York. He bought- he bought, reported in New York. He bought the- He said that think of the words. Yeah. America. America is not different. Yes. In any case, he did become a citizen later on. And he felt that- the Rebbe felt that the American Jews are very special in a good way that can be dealt with in Yiddishkeit. It can be taught. But the Rebbe even more. So the-
Rabbi Krinsky: I mean, I the what I want to say is in his first year he he established a corporation Agudas Chassidei Chabad. That was the first American thing that he did. And three years later he incorporated Merkos L'inyonei Chinuch of the next year Machne Israel. And he tells- he tells the Shluchim that they go out publicly and privately, and perhaps in cases that wherever they go, wherever they open a Chabad house, they should get all the legal work, local, state, federal, and also be very, very, very careful with your accountancy. Financial accounting. And whether you have Shluchim it's interesting whether you talk about American aid nation. But we have the Kinus Hashluchim every year that the gathering a world gathering of Shluchim. This year we missed past the year before, but this year we had close to 6000 people in one room in a banquet. The people there that don't can't speak, don't speak the same language anymore or never did so the Shluchim have to have translators to translate for them- between them. They don't understand some of the speeches because they don't speak English or even Hebrew. To the extent. So it's very Americanized. Very, very Americanized.
Professor Franks: From an outsider's point of view, it's fascinating to meet a Chabad almost everywhere that one goes. But one wonders what is the corporate structure? How centralized is the organization? How much is it like a franchise operation?
Rabbi Krinsky: Franchise.
Professor Franks: How would you describe it?
Rabbi Krinsky: It's a very clear. What am I thinking of? Each one is independent. They have to conduct themselves according to the Shulchon Aruch. But different countries have different. The commercial prop things and schooling and whatever the laws are, they have to they have to abide by the law. They're very, very honest financially and in terms of studying and teaching. It's centralized that that all comes from the Rebbe. But the Rebbe quotes often the Gemara in Eilu Metzios Odom Rotzeh B'kav Shelo a person wants to have his own possession and the Rebbe wants them to have the ownership in terms of the, the, the, the, the running of the institution as they see fit according to that community. And it's working. I can just tell you this, that every week new Shluchim go out in different places. People who never saw that ever. And the devotion with which they go out is it- you can't even describe it. The same love is the Rebbe would have called them in the husband and the wife. Maybe a toddler or two going on in it, no matter where they're going. The same devotion. Nobody else in the world did it. Nobody else in the world can do it, and nobody in the world will ever do it. Chabad is growing vastly. There are thousands of shluchim now all over the world, in cities and islands and territories they've never heard of. They're all listening to me.
Rabbi Krinsky: It's enormous. And it keeps on growing. And in fact, the Rebbe I get when my mind is tied to many things together. The Rebbe spoke many times that even some Shluchim were in larger cities, especially in larger cities, should realize that there are neighborhoods that they can't reach that's beyond their their reach. And certainly not in an intensive way. Bring down shluchim under you. You be the boss of the state of the country. And that's how it is. The chief of state, the chief of chief of a country and work together in unison and exchange information or discuss things. Help each other. That's how it functions. It's amazing. That's how it is, and that's what's going to keep it growing. And I just, I just I find it I mean, I hope I live long enough to see it grow even more, but but it's really it's really astounding that thousands and thousands of people, that's hardly an area, a geographical area in the world. If somebody, someone needs something that they can't find a Lubavitcher Shliach for emergencies, they're sometimes the first responders in Nepal. Nepal is not a Jewish country, but they have Jewish visitors and the Israeli people, the what do they call them after the after they travel, what do they call them? Backpacking. Well, that's in America too, but they they're evangelistic evangelists at some time there and I witnessed this.
Rabbi Krinsky: There's no no there is there is a Shlichach Rabbi Lifshitz who who live in the capital of Nepal. Kathmandu. I used to be good at geography. The he needs to hire helicopters to help people. They're not Jewish. But he does it. Everyone's called up the Jewish organization, the joint distribution Committee, and asked them if they were that. What exactly? There was an avalanche in Nepal. And people are dying and the Shliach not that rich, but it costs them $25,000 for a helicopter. And he needed many helicopters. It was a big bill. So they said, then we'll send them some money. But their first responders, not for Jewish people. There was a bus turned over in Chile a couple of years ago. Who was there? Chabad was there many, many cases, the floods, the hurricanes in our country, in Florida and in Texas, wherever it happens, who's going to go up 20 floors to a sick lady who needs a medicine? She can't get down. She can't get she can't go. The elevators not working. She can't get her pills. What do you do? So the school got kids together and they served these people, went up and down the stairs. Saved lives just by bringing them bread. And what's- something to eat, something to drink. Chabad... They don't they don't they don't not not Jewish, we're not going to help them.
Professor Franks: Are you concerned about saturating the market? Imagine that every campus already has a Chabad house, and there's a Shul everywhere. What is the next generation going to do?
Rabbi Krinsky: You got to tell you this story. Listen to this, ladies and gentlemen. This was public information. It started online. A Rabbi in Texas who claims to have the largest conservative temple in America. I forgot his name. That's not important for this. And his daughter went off to Virginia to college. And the day she got to to Virginia, she calls up her father. She says, dad, I knew which room I'm going to be having in the dormitory of this. I don't remember the name of the university, and I bought a Mezuzah special for that purpose, for that room to put it up in the room when I come, I'm here and I don't have the Mezuzah. Look around the house if you can find it. I need the Mezuzah. You wanted it dearly. He couldn't find the Mezuzah in the house, so she says- so he says he calls up Amazon. That's what he said. He called up Amazon. They says we need five days. We'll get you a Mezuzah. He called up the synagogue. Nobody answered. He mentioned four people that he called, that there was no Mezuzah. So he says it's on television. He says, well, look, it's real close to Chabad. I'll try Chabad. He calls up the Chabad house in the university and tells the daughters saga, and he says to her, I'll be there in 30 minutes. And he brought her two Challos for Shabbos and candles for Shabbos Licht.
Rabbi Krinsky: What do you say. Tell another story that pertains to women that comes to mind. As I said, I was involved with a few stories. We have the time? About public relations. I got a call from the New York Times, Ari Goldman, Jewish writer, and he asked me he's doing he was commissioned to do a story for Hadassah magazine. It's a woman's magazine, of course, and he wants to know if Chabad has anything special with the relationship between parents and school children. The children at school, it's something that's very important to know now, if I'm correct. Parents mixing in the schools, you know- you know what I mean? I'm sure you do. So. So I told him something that I had read in the Chassidik literature; that the previous Rebbe's father, Rashab So, Sholom Ber Shneerson, said that the parents, that mothers and fathers, should spend a half an hour every night in discussing the Chinuch of their children. And I told this to him that there's a close connection and the Rebbe is telling you that Al Pi Torah you have to do it Veshinantom Levonecha. Okay, so so he printed that story with, with a little more relish, and about a month later the Rebbe's speaking Shabbos at the Farbrengen.
Rabbi Krinsky: And he told this story. What the Rebbe Rashab said. But parents spending a half an hour every night of the educational welfare of their children. I- that's exactly what I- when I came home from the Farbrengen, I got my mail. That's the magazine came in the mail. And that story is printed in the Hadassah issue. So Sunday, I couldn't wait to get to the Rebbe to tell him how that how that, you know, it's not a. And so the Rebbe got up, went over to the bookcase, takes out a Shulchon Aruch Choshen Mishpot just before the last, last Halacha before Choshen Mishpot all sat up and he showed me what it says there. He picked up the word Hadassah the Rebbe. See he wanted to do something with Hadassah? That's what that's pretty typical of that. Of picking something that somebody thinks something is unimportant. The Rebbe can show exactly how important it is. And it says over there that husbands should know, that they should be very careful with the honor of their wives. Do I think I have it in my pocket? Mind if I take a look? Sorry. I don't want to take any extra time. The Rebbe showed me the Halacha in Shulchan Aruch. The husbands should be very careful with honoring their wives because the Parnosa of the family is the Zchus of the wife.
Rabbi Krinsky: Parnosa of your life, your livelihood, livelihood that you're getting is because of your wife and her marriage. It happens to be a Gemara in Bava Metzia if you want to look it up. I'll leave it at that. So he wanted me to write a letter to the editors of the magazine, with this Halacha, for whatever purpose it would serve. I never heard again from them, but but. No. I know that magazine still comes out. There's another story I want to tell you. Rabbi Hecht am I- am I doing something wrong? I want to tell you a story that I think drives home in a very dramatic way, the work of Shluchim and Shluchos. And I- When I say Shluchim, I mean the wives and the children. Sometimes children of the Shluchim have more effect on the community than the parents, because they're children. That the Gemara in Megila. It says Omar Rabbi Yossi, Rabbi Yossi was a Talmudic sage. All my life I was pained by this certain verse in the Torah, in Chumash in Parshas Ki Savo, in the Tochecha in Ki Savo. It says over there that I will, I will, I will punish you like the blind man, and you will grope like the blind man gropes in the darkness. I never understood that verse. What difference does it make to the blind man if it's darkness or day? He can't see in any case. Until something happened that set me right. I was walking alone in a very dark night and I see somebody walking with a lantern. And I got closer to the person. I see that he's blind. He asks the person- asks the blind person, what good is this lantern that you're carrying if you can't see anybody? The blind man answered, it's not for me, it's for you. That you should see me. You should take care of me. I shouldn't fall into a hole or into a painful thick. Every Jew had to have had a lantern. Somebody has to help them. It's a Gemara. And I think the perfect description of what Shluchim are doing, to whatever extent it is.
Professor Franks: In order for the Rebbe to have the impact that he has had on America and on the rest of the world, he had to have a great deal of information about what was going on in the world. What were the sources of his information? Was he reading the newspapers.
Rabbi Krinsky: You reminded me of something. Israeli government of prime ministers and military people, the generals, the they all came to there at one time or another. Everyone except Golda Meir, whatever the reason and they saw that the Rebbe knew, the general saw that the Rebbe knew, the terrain in different parts of Israel for the for the for the military to know. It's important in warfare. How did he know? I don't know. What I did every single day for a long time, I was sending to the Rebbe every day clippings from different newspapers. And way back, there were ten different newspapers in New York and magazines or something of anything I think that ever might be interested in. Not only Jewish things, but secular things, medical things, legal things. The Rebbe was interested in everything. And I would see sometimes when we went home in the afternoon. I went with him to afternoon for three quarters of an hour. He had he was carrying it home to show his wife, I assume, who else would he show it to? So the knew things. I don't know how he knew them. I got a lot of mail. May it may be- I really don't know. But he was aware of everything that was going on. And one time I sent in a clipping of a story, something about Judeo-Christian, something. I don't remember what the issue was, something about Judaic, Christian. And the afternoon the Rebbe called me and he said, what happened to Islam? Can you imagine? You know who this is?
Professor Franks: I believe, I think from on the basis of something that you told me before, there was also some involvement of, with some of the people in the arts in-.
Rabbi Krinsky: Yes, yes, yes.
Professor Franks: Theatre and sculpture.
Rabbi Krinsky: I want to give you one more story about about journalism. When I- from the first day I went into the office I mentioned before, the Rebbe told me first week about about not getting perturbed, confused. Everything will work out. I started getting in touch with the newspapers that the newspapers in New York and the Anglo-Jewish papers. There were about 120 of them. I got a directory in the country. I wrote letters to each of them. I sent them newsletters. There was no email then. So you had to go to the post office 3:00 in the morning and make sure they would get it the next day. The information- What the Rebbe spoke Shabbos or something? That was whatever, whatever it was, it was hundreds of. And I had trouble. The only trouble I had with a paper I had with the New York Times.
Rabbi Krinsky: I couldn't reach them. I couldn't get, I couldn't. There was one writer by the name, a Jewish man by the name of Irving Spiegel. Pat Spiegel, he was called and he had a he had a lock on Jewish news was going in to the newspaper. I remember him holiday news and whatever, whatever it was, had a Jewish content. He was the one who decided if it goes into the paper or not, and I couldn't, I couldn't get through to him, a Jewish man. So I called him one time.
Rabbi Krinsky: Well. So one time my wife had moved my problem and she says to me, I knew his wife by that time, Spiegel's wife, she was a fine woman, not like the husband at all. And she says, why don't you know? Why don't you invite them over some night for dinner. And it will be a Farbrengen like in the weekday, and you'll introduce them to the Rebbe when they have the little break between the talks. So that was a great idea. So they both came. It was Tu Bishvat. So in was in the middle of the week, there was no problem with Shabbos and traveling. So one of the breaks I went over to the Rebbe with Pat. I said, this is Mr. Spiegel from the New York Times. The Rebbe looks at him. He pours him some wine in a cup to say l'chaim. And the Rebbe say l'chaim with him. You know what he tells him? Mr. Spiegel, you can reach more Jews than I can. And you know what happened? From that moment, became a different person. Yeah. They have one son. Became Shomer Shabbos, married a fine girl, had children. He works with the government and lives in near Washington. It's a pretty good idea and it took no time. That was wisdom. And from that day on, whatever had news, he printed it. You can check it in the, I guess, in the library.
Rabbi Krinsky: I thought you wanted to. You asked about an art?
Professor Franks: Yes.
Rabbi Krinsky: Yeah. It was a famous sculpture with the name of Jacques Lipschitz. He was born in Russia, but he lived most of his life in France with Picasso. He was that kind of fellow. Yeah. And he came to America. He got sick. He had to go to the hospital. And one of our lawyers who worked with us in New York had a relative who knew him. So he visited him in the hospital. And Jacques asks him, what do you do? I'm a lawyer. I work for the Lubavitcher Rebbe. So he says, yeah, if I live to get out of the hospital, I have to go see that man. By the way, his brother's name was Krinsky and came from the- came from not too far from my mother- my father came from... Used to anyways. What happened was he got better and he arranged to come to the Rebbe in an afternoon, which was unusual. They spent a long time the next day. The Rebbe sent him a pair of Tefillin. He told me later he never missed a day since. So anyways, he had completed a huge sculpture, a bronze sculpture, of a phoenix. It doesn't look like a bird, but he calls it the Phoenix. It's about 20ft. He had almost finished it, and he passed away in Italy. We took care of his funeral, he's buried in Israel and his widow, Ula, didn't know what to do. And she was a sculptor in Rome. She could finish it with small touches up, that she could finish it. But the worst thing happened that the Israel government reneged on their agreement. It's a Christian something or other.
Rabbi Krinsky: And you can't bring it up. How can we do something like that with a Christian nature to to Israel, the Holy Land? And she was very broken. So I suggested one day to her, go to the Rebbe. Tell him, tell him you feel bad. Tell him. Tell him, the Rebbe will cheer you up. So I got her an appointment. It was an appointment that I was in charge of the people coming in to deliver that evening. And her turn came and she went in. She sat down and about five minutes into the conversation the Rebbe pressed the intercom I should come in to him. He asks me to take down the book of Iyov - Job from the bookcase in his room. And which I did. And he turned some pages. He says, read this. It says over there in Perek Chof Tes I wrote down. It says Bachachol Arab Yamim. Rashi explains very clearly Chol is the bird that lives for a thousand years and then burns to a crisp and is resuscitated after from from the ground. So the Christian doctrine in any way, form or fashion. Well, of course. It went up on the hospital. What's the name of the hospital in Yerusholayim? That's up. That's the hospital. I hadn't seen it all the years until the last time I was in Israel. A long time ago. I went to see it. It's done a beautiful, like a plateau. A that's quite a big piece. That's all there is over there is that. And there's an inscription above the one who made it, the sculptor. So this this is another case of a woman that was helped her life long hope. The Rebbe took care of her just by being so smart.
Professor Franks: You've mentioned the visits of Israeli leaders, both political and military, to the Rebbe. And of course, the establishment of the State of Israel is one of the biggest developments in in Jewish history. And there's a great deal of Chabad activity, many Chabad Hasidim in Israel. And yet the Rebbe did not visit. Was there ever a discussion of the visit of the possibility of visiting?
Rabbi Krinsky: I'm going to have to get help from one of my Bagleiter. I always wondered why. I never asked him the question. As close as I was, it's not my business. He can take care of himself, especially something of that magnitude. And I was in my public relations. I was very friendly with what's his name, the fellow Krauthammer, Charles Krauthammer. We all know Charles Krauthammer. He was a great guy. He was very, very nice guy. He was Jewish. And you couldn't tell he was a paraplegic because he used to. People didn't know that he was, but he was actually in Boston when he was going to Harvard at the same time as Ira Weiss, the doctor that I mentioned before. What happened was he jumped in a pool that had no water, and he remained. Ira Weiss knew him. The Rebbe's doctor. So what happened was he called me once and he says to me, the Rebbe Israel, why doesn't he go to Israel? Why didn't he ever visit Israel? It's so noticeable. So I figured here it's part of my job, and I figured I could say it in his name. I can't say I'm not going to tell the Rebbe what he wanted. I can't do that. He can write himself. I don't know if the Rebbe will get to that and when he'll get to it. So. So I asked the Rebbe. So the Rebbe answered me in writing. Then according to Halacha, if you go to Israel, you can't leave unless for two purposes: to study Torah and to marry. And he can't do that because he's already married in it. So. Not that not not that I understand it to say that, you know, the Rebbe probably had other means as well. But that was a there was a legitimate halachic Psak.
Professor Franks: What do you see as the greatest opportunities and challenges that face Chabad today?
Rabbi Krinsky: We've been talking Chabad to overcome all these problems, and we generally do. I think if there was such a theory available, the Rebbe would have had it. I can't- I'm not so smart. All I know is on the contrary, like the Rebbe said, ultimately, it'll all work out. We have to do what we can. Plus, my parents did it for me and God will do it for the Jewish people. Despite all the stories that we've had over the past century. Can't get over that but-
Rabbi Krinsky: I think that the Shluchim are demonstrating the joy with which they go out. They're not in it for money. All of them. Most of them don't have enough money, but they're living and they're happy. They have children, they go to school and they love each other. I hope. I all I can, all I can see is the practical way that it's happening before our eyes. The more shluchim that go out, the less intermarriage there will be, and the less Tzaros there will be families and it will be a happier place. Well, I want to finish with. Take a minute. Take a minute. You'll appreciate this. The Rebbe had a stroke March 2nd, the year it was that I was the only one with him. He was at the Ohel. And what happened subsequent to that happened, unfortunately. But a week before, you know about the Rebbe giving up Dallas Sunday. You all know that probably maybe many of you have been there. Should have been. To get a dollar from the Rebbe. And there was a journalist. We didn't allow journalists in interviews in the minds of thousands of people waiting. And one journalist waited to the end. I was there. And the Rebbe's- the Rebbe's approaching his 90th birthday.
Rabbi Krinsky: And there were journalists all over Crown Heights trying to get more information on the Rebbe. In fact, in fact, there was one journalist from- the New York Times called me that they wanted a son, Michael, Michael, Michael... Give his last name. Yeah, I know. Michael Specter, one of the- I knew him from the Washington Post from before this, and he was transferred to The Times. And they're sending him to spend hours with me to see to find out what the Rebbe's all about. I spent a lot of time with him. And there came a time where he asked me, tell me Rabbi Krinsky, where does the Rebbe live? Well the Rebbe had a nice home in President Street where he lived with the Rebbetzin, but after the Rebbetzin passed away, he moved everything to his office, and he would go back. And even the year that he left, the year after she passed away, he was home. But he would come to 770 Shabbos and he would come 770 in any case. But at this point, the Rebbe was living in his office, the room that we have, some of us grew up like. And so Michael asks me where does the Rebbe live? I'd like to see where he lives. I was stunned, what am I going to show him? One room.
Rabbi Krinsky: And it had a washroom. And I- I told the Rebbe he wants to know what was going on. He told them he wants to see me and he said, okay, I'll be going out this day. A few days, a couple of minutes. I'll give you the key. I'll give you the key. It he wasn't concerned the Rebbe. So the time came. We opened the door. He said, is that all there is? One room. A bed. A desk. A lamp. And the table. And I told them that you have to learn- you have to learn the book of Nevi'im, where where the Novi would come to this couple from time to time. And the wife decided the husband, the husband to build a room, an attic for him. It should have a table, a chair, a bed and a candle. That's what the Rebbe had. That's what he was living there. That's where he lived. He Davened in Shul. And so that's where he slept. For a long time. So this Rebbe was running the world? Sincerely with all his being. With everything he had. That's how he lived. And he didn't care. He cared because he lost his wife. He missed her.
Rabbi Krinsky: So anyways, this fellow came, the journalist came, one of the last in line and asked a very pointed question nobody asked him, Rebbe, what's the significance of 90 become a 90 years old? What's the significance of a 90? Without any hesitation, the Rebbe said that in the Hebrew alphabet, every letter has the numeric value. The letter for the numeric value of 90 is Tzadik. Tzadik means the righteousness. We must constantly strive to be more judged, more righteous. But what's enough for yesterday was not enough for today. Today we have to prepare for a better tomorrow. I want to conclude with that because we are in that tomorrow. Isn't that poetic?
Q&A | Rabbi Yehuda Krinsky & Professor Paul Franks
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Professor Franks: Well, I think we've reached a point in the evening where we could entertain a few questions from the from the audience. I'll just ask you if if you have a question and to indicate that. And I'll call on you. And if you could stand up and just maybe say your name as well. And then your question for Rabbi Krinsky.
Audience: Thank you for speaking with us. I'm Charlie Cano. I was wondering whether the Rebbe ever expressed to you any fears. Doubts? Just the sort of normal things that we all experience. And that if I remember previous Rabbeim him very much expressed that in some of their writings.
Rabbi Krinsky: I never saw anything similar to fears in my life. And whenever he was just the opposite. He had a lot of problems. Other people's problems that he helped solve, to try to solve. But fear? No.
Rabbi Shmully Hecht: Anybody here with a question?
Audience: Thank you so much. My name is Jessica. I'm coming from Washington, D.C., from Georgetown University. Can you hear.
Rabbi Krinsky: Coming from where?
Audience: From Washington, D.C.. Yeah.
Rabbi Krinsky: Oh.
Audience: And I have a question about the and I teach, yes, I teach. I teach Jewish Civilization at Georgetown, Jewish Civilization, Jewish Studies at Georgetown University. And my question is about the question of the leadership connecting to the fact that the Rebbe is not present anymore. And maybe connecting to potentially question the question that he had, like the fact what his legacy will be today and for tomorrow for future generation. It's a little bit broad question, but I was wondering if it was part of the conversation that you had with him.
Rabbi Krinsky: If I understand you correctly, about the future of the movement, you mean?
Audience: Yeah. And the fact that.
Rabbi Krinsky: I'll answer-.
Audience: Leadership.
Rabbi Krinsky: I'll answer you.
Audience: Thank you.
Rabbi Krinsky: The Rebbe lost his wife in the second 22nd day of Menachem-Av Chof Beis Shevat I'm sorry. I know I'm tired. And three hours after the funeral, which was on a Wednesday, he called me into his office. And he told me that he wanted to do for him three things. Let me see if I can remember them. First of all, he wanted, he says, for some reason, my wife and I never made a Will. I would like you to arrange a lawyer, spoke about who, a lawyer to write a Will. I would like it to be finished during the week of Shiva. You know what that is. The second thing I would like you to do is to look through the legal papers of all three organizations. The three amudim posts upon which the House of Lubavitch rests. One was Agudas Chassidei Chabad, one was Merkos L'inyonei Chinuch and the third one was Machne Israel. I should go through them and see if there are any vacancies, any vacancies, and if you can suggest with whom to fix fill the vacancies the Rebbe wanted. These three organizations should be in charge of the movement in terms of the legal aspects of it going forward. And that's exactly what I did. He made me the executor of his estate, the sole executor, which I knew when the time comes, there will be a lot of people who won't agree with him. But they can't do it. They can't, they can't. They can't do anything about it. And the, that was actually the case. So these three things. Oh, the third thing I would say, the third thing, the third thing, he wanted to make a fund, a charitable fund in the name of his wife that just passed away three hours after the, after the funeral. He wanted to call it Keren Hachomesh. Hachomesh in Hebrew was the Roshei Teivos, Horabonis Chaya mushka Schneerson. And we did that actually my son Shmaya was here, he raised, a lot of funds for that particular thing and the Rebbetzin's and the Rebbe's honor. Did that answer your question?
Audience: Hi, I'm Sam Freiberg. I live here in in New York. I was invited by somebody in the group to hear you speak. I just- I work for Aish Hatorah. I was very moved when you spoke about your personal fascination with the Rebbe from a very young age. Now that, do you feel that you have something that the next generation can't access because they don't have that living person? And I think every everybody would like to have such a person in their life. Do you think about how the fact that that person's not there? How do we compensate for that?
Rabbi Krinsky: I think that that's a nice issue. Like on by what I said tonight, many, many instances answered your question. The shluchim that go out now the normal people husband usually a year they spend a year in the Kolel, then they decide where they want to go on Shlichus. And couples, sometimes with a child or two or whatever the inspiration that I see and I can feel this is a lifelong there's a one way ticket that's not a joke. They don't have Shluchim going back and forth doesn't happen. It's a one way ticket to the destination. Things can change and of course in time depending on your circumstances. But they have that inspiration. By learning the Rebbe's Chassidus, thank God. One of the things I did- In the 19 was Tof Shin Lamed Beis, which was that 32
Rabbi Shmully Hecht: '72.
Rabbi Krinsky: 1972 I started filming the Rebbe's public addresses and many other things about them. But prior to that, there's a library with thousands and thousands of hours of the Rebbe talking. It was black and white, then later on became color. The satellite transmissions from 770 around the world when it became developed. Now you can just press a button. We had to have ten trailer trucks in front of 770 when we had a live transmission of the Rebbe's farbrengen. on Yud Tes Kislev. There was no that's the only way you could transmit it. People wanted to see it live as it was happening. Hanukkah? The Hanukkah Menorah was in the Kosel Hamarovi by Chabad in Jerusalem. I watched it in the Rebbe's room together. So, so to answer your question, it's not it's there's no question. And it's happening in increasing numbers. Again, imagine the couple they want to do spend their lives doing what the Rebbe wanted, because that's what they feel the Eibeshter wanted to to to to promote the Yiddishkeit in every single conceivable way. Why others don't have it. All I can say is they didn't have the Rebbe that we had.
Audience: I have a question. I'm Rusty Reno. I'm the editor of First Things magazine, and maybe I'm, Rabbi yeah. I have a question and you, my experience with Chabad. The overwhelming experience is one of joy. You've described the Rebbe as a man of tremendous self-discipline. What how what- how did he inspire a movement that could have so much spontaneity and joy?
Rabbi Krinsky: There is no contradiction between the two? I don't see any. I'm looking for something and if I can't find it, it's a shame. I got it, I got it. I want to read you something. You spoke- we spoke about Rabbi Yossi from the Gemara from like 18, 1900 years ago. I have something from the New York Times that appeared last week on Sunday in the first in the front page of the style section.
Audience: Joy.
Rabbi Krinsky: Do you want me to talk till tomorrow? You want me to talk till tomorrow morning? Where is it? Yeah. Oh, I don't have it. But two pages I wanted to read to you. Got it.
Rabbi Krinsky: This is talking about a young lady who's trying to resurrect a Jewish newspaper that I remember seeing. It's called Jewish Currents, but it's sort of drifted away, and she's trying to resuscitate it so she. This story, as I said, it was a little magazine built on big ideas.
Rabbi Krinsky: The interview Emma Goldberg with with the with the editor. The new editor. They have- they they made their office on Eastern Parkway near the Grand Army Plaza and the Union Temple of the Reformed Temple on Eastern Parkway, opposite the Museum. Fancy place. She writes like this. I'm writing about the right. Yeah. This is what she told the writer. In a crosswalk near Eastern Parkway, a man in traditional Hasidic garb, approached them, a group of editors, with a question that made me- that may be familiar to New Yorkers who have run into members of the Chabad Lubavitch group. Excuse me, he said. Are any of you Jewish? The group started burst out laughing. Not a single one. That's the that's the first paragraph of the story. The final paragraph of the story. In an essay describing an encounter she had on the street with some Hasidim Hasidic boys, who asked her, are you Jewish? She said, yes, and they blew the ram's horn for me. It was it was Rosh Hashanah. Walking away, she wrote, she felt newly awake. Touched my- touched by the their desire to share a thing of beauty with with strangers.
Rabbi Krinsky: That's what I want to tell you. I don't want to mention the name of the editor, because I don't know...
Audience: Moderation.
Toby Hecht: Hi. Good evening everybody. Saying hi to this room and that room over there and this large room here, I just want to first of all, thank you so much, Rabbi Krinsky and professor Professor Paul Franks for being here tonight and taking time out of your very busy schedule to share your evening and your thoughts with us here. I want to thank everybody here for coming and participating in this wonderful historic event. I want to thank Rabbi Yirmi Berkowitz and Rabbi Shmaya Krinsky for all their help as well. And I just want to close with a story that can kind of, you know, bring all of this together for me. Naomi started off the night mentioning my grandmother and her upcoming day of passing that we decided to dedicate this evening to. And I just want to share one story of the first time my grandmother came to see the Lubavitcher Rebbe, and she came with my mother in the in August of 1964, I believe it was the year that New York hosted the World Fair and on my mother's way to school in Baltimore for an all girls school, all the way from Los Angeles, they decided to stop in New York on the way. And the rabbi in Los Angeles, who my grandparents were very close with, who was sent to Los Angeles by the previous Lubavitcher Rebbe to be there for their surviving, the survivors coming from the aftermath of the Holocaust, my grandparents being two, and my grandmother, who had grown up in a Hasidic community in Northern Transylvania. This was her first time meeting the Lubavitcher Rebbe, and as my sister said, she was a cosmopolitan woman, a traditional woman living in a very modern life, in a way, she was a businesswoman, and she was a community builder along with my grandfather.
Toby Hecht: And when she was looking for a place for my mother to go for high school. She thought of the school in Switzerland. I don't know if if anyone here is familiar with it. I think it was an it was called the Usher School. And the rabbi in Los Angeles, Rabbi Raichik of blessed memory, told my grandmother to write in to the Lubavitcher Rebbe. And so she did. Or they did together, my grandparents, and the Rebbe wrote back that it is not on par with the way it used to be, as in previously before the war. And my grandmother, for the life of her, could not understand how this rabbi, this rebbe in New York City, of all places, could know about some boarding school in Switzerland. And so she listened, and they decided and said to send her to my mother, to Bais Yaakov in Baltimore. And so here they were, on their way for my mother's first year to be away from home and they stopped in New York. And it's late at night. They're staying in Manhattan. They take a train to Eastern Parkway to see the Rebbe for a private audience. My grandmother was very nervous. This is not what she was familiar with, because in Europe, when you saw or when a woman went to get a blessing from the Rebbe, she stood at the door post to the door, but didn't actually go into the room and hear Rabbi Raichik in California was telling her, not only is she going to go into the room, but she's going to hand a zetel, a note, handwritten by her into the hand of the Lubavitcher Rabbi, and she's telling him in her Hungarian Yiddish, and he's responding in his Russian Yiddish.
Toby Hecht: She's like, vas redst du. And he's saying, no, you have to do this. And she says, okay. So she writes a zetel and she and my mother come in. My mother is 13 and I'm not sure how old my grandmother was. And they come into the room. It's late by the time they're able to get their private audience, as Rabbi Krinsky mentioned, all these audiences, a lot of them were done late at night until very early in the morning, and they come in and my grandmother, the Rebbe, offers my grandmother seat, which she sits and she takes my mother sitting. And my grandmother had handed him, as you know, noted by Rabbi Raichik, the note in the Rebbe's hand. And my grandfather, my, my, the Rebbe starts speaking to my grandmother, and then he turns to my mother. And for me, this is the like the formative experience of growing up in my home and in my grandparents home. And he turns to my grandmother, my mother, and starts to speak with her, this 13 year old girl about what she is studying in school in Los Angeles. And she talks about Oliver Twist, and the Rebbe is getting into a conversation with my mother about Oliver Twist and what, you know, she thinks about the book and this is their experience.
Toby Hecht: This is my grandmother's first experience and my mother's first experience meeting the Lubavitcher Rebbe. Immediately upon leaving the room, there were many people that would come in one after the other, and the secretaries kept looking in to make sure, you know, it's, you know, we've got to keep the program going. My mother, my grandmother leave the room and immediately burst into tears. And this is a formative experience for my mother, who later, she's in a Bais Yakov school which is not a Lubavitch school, but later on really chooses several years later to marry my father, who's from a a Lubavitch family. And as my sister Naomi said, these visits changed the trajectory of my family and here we are tonight. So I just want to say thank you again Rabbi Krinsky. You are a household name within the Lubavitch movement and beyond. We all know how dedicated, how ibergigeben and the word ibergigeben is in Yiddish. It means given over how dedicated you were to the Lubavitcher Rebbe. And that remains and that will go on, and that will be your legacy. And what a tremendous legacy you carry for yourself and your family. And, Professor Franks, I just want to thank you so much. I couldn't think of a more fitting person to be here tonight in conversation with Rabbi Krinsky. Again, thank you all and have a wonderful night. We hope to see you again soon. Thank you.